Today’s news is powered by a Yellow Submarine:
- Are the Yanks interested in adding Aroldis Chapman?:
The Yankees are monitoring Chapman’s situation and will undoubtedly be interested in signing a 21-year-old left-hander whose fastball exceeds 100 miles an hour and who was touted as the best pitching prospect in Cuba. So far, General Manager Brian Cashman has not commented on Chapman, but the Yankees have been aggressive in signing international pitchers like Orlando Hernandez and Jose Contreras.
Roberto González Echevarría, a professor at Yale University who has written extensively about Cuban baseball, called Chapman “the most promising young pitcher” to leave Cuba in 50 years.
- Friend of the Banter Allen Barra is concerned about the Yanks:
(Joba) Chamberlain went just three innings, was hammered for seven runs on six hits and three walks, handing the Yankees their second series loss in the last ten days. And the excuse was the recent A.J. Burnett mantra: “If not for one or two bad pitches …” Memo to A.J. and Joba: a three-run homer is not — repeat, not — one mistake. It is, at the very least, three mistakes.
Joba hasn’t gone more than five innings since August 11, and in his last seven starts, has gone just 20 innings, giving up 39 hits and walking 12 against just 17 strikeouts. Let’s make that even more dramatic: in his five starts since the Yankees began this ridiculous “New Rules” (with apologies to Bill Maher) approach, Joba has pitched 16 innings, given up 23 hits, struck out 10, and given up 14 earned runs for an eye-gouging ERA of 7.87. . . .
Is there a team in baseball with a worse record of developing young pitchers than the Yankees? Was there any more illogical way to bring Joba along than to put him in games where he was expected to only go three or four innings? If whoever is calling the shots in the front office had conferred with Joe Girardi and pitching coach Dave “No Man Is An” Eiland and at least agreed to put Job aback in the bullpen to be worked in front of Phil Hughes, they might at least have something to show for all the absurd coddling and pampering of Joba. All they’ve got now is a big fat ugly decision as to whether or not he should be included on the postseason roster — and if the numbers mean anything, the answer to that question is an emphatic no.
- Pete Abraham knows who should be the AL MVP:
MVP talk always stirs debate and it has again. (Derek) Jeter has had a terrific season and is worthy of recognition. But (Joe) Mauer is having an historically significant season and is doing so while playing a premium defensive position.
Jeter is eighth on his own team in OPS and seventh in OPS+. And spare me the “he’s great leader” stuff. Do you think Joe Mauer walks around kicking old ladies and discouraging his teammates from playing well? I’ll check to make sure, but I’m guessing he does not.
Nobody outside of the team — and that includes reporters — can quantify leadership. That is impossible. I personally believe Jeter is a very fine leader. But I can’t say he’s any better at that than Mauer is. How would I know?
I’ve tried to look at every statistic — even those I find fishy — and I’ve talked to a bunch of people to solicit opinions. It keeps coming back to Mauer every time.
- A couple of tidbits from an online chat with Jay Jaffe (starting with a question from yours truly):
dianagramr (NYC): . . . How much of Joba Chamberlain’s uneven 2009 can be attributed to the way the Yanks have handled him, and how much can be attributed to Joba’s maturity (attitude towards looking at video, casual nature in interviews after bad performances)
Jay Jaffe: . . . I think the two things go hand in hand – the Yanks have jerked Chamberlain around, and he’s apparently not terribly well suited to such handling. In retrospect, given his innings limitiations they probably should have followed last year’s template and started the year with him in the bullpen, then moved him into the rotation mid-season and kept him there (without the injury part that disrupted 2008’s plan, of course).
tbrown05 (vt): Hey Jay, I’m pretty concerned about the Yankees rotation entering the postseason. The first round should work to their favor (assuming the enter with the AL’s best record) with 2 days of rest and a 3 man rotation. However, if it comes to the ALCS and a 4 man rotation, what do you anticipate?? Will they even bother starting Joba at this point? Thanks.
Jay Jaffe: I think yesterday’s start might have sealed the deal on the team’s first-round decision, given how awful Joba was, and assuming Pettitte comes back in one piece. Beyond that… well, it’s been so long since the Yankees got out of the first round I’m not really sure what to expect. I do think the odds of Chad Gaudin getting an October start just spiked.
- Comparing and contrasting the response to the new Stadium versus the new home of the Cowboys.
- The annual rookie hazing took place after Sunday’s loss.
- Bob Geren turns 48 today. The current manager of the A’s was a part-time catcher with the Yanks from ’88-’91, His bat was subpar, but he nailed nearly 40% of base-stealers during his time with the Yankees.
Wait, we expect the mediots to be unbiased? Ha!
I never knew that about Karras. I wish Webster had kicked him in the nuts a few times.
Chapman is exactly the guy the Yanks should drop $50 million on. That's exactly where their financial muscle needs to be flexed. I don't care if he's ever worth it. You spend when you can get talent like that - Darvish too. Even if the bidding goes higher, you suck it up and pay the cost. Of course Chapman doesn't require the posting fee and there's no luxury tax. There's no reason they shouldn't sign him, especially since he throws from the gauche side.
Glad I'm not staying up for these late west coast games.
And yes, go after Chapman.
Chad Gaudin? A playoff start? Has it come to this?
Hindsight on Joba is easy, but the issue with his innings was why some of us were urging a decent 3rd/4th starter pickup at the deadline. It is very, very hard to have a starter's focus and energy when you KNOW it is not your game, you are gone in 3-4 innings. You need a lot of poise and maturity, and a part of running a team, in the dugout or front office, is surely knowing these components in your players.
Benign as I am, generally, and knowing every team has slack periods, it is getting a bit old saying 'there's a silver lining, Pettitte seemed okay' and lines like that. The team is scuffling, and it isn't just the rotation. This isn't close to a panic button (I hid it) but we're headed into the media cauldron, and pressure adds to scuffle, usually.
Allen Barra's correct, but he'd make a terrible school nurse.
"Of course you skinned yer god damn knee. You were climbing a tree, you idiot! What did you expect!? Now, rub this salt in there, and get out of my office."
Chad Gaudin? A playoff start? Has it come to this?
If it has, who's to blame?
They used Jaret Wright in 2006. They used Wang on short rest in 2007 after an awful Game 1.
That's horrid.
But at least they have Hughes to pitch the 8th inning.
So...does Joba start a playoff game or not then..?? Is anyone here going to be calm, cool and collected watching him pitch to Bobby Abreu, Vlad, and Torii Hunter let alone Miguel Cabrera...
Brilliant reading on Jones's monstrosity. I still can't believe NBC (and apparently, the Cowboys themselves), compared it to the Great Wall of China, the Taj Mahal, and the Roman Coliseum (among other structures). Way to show perspective. (Can you imagine the national outcry if the Yanks and YES had done that with YS 2.0?!)
My first thought, on seeing that thing, was that it made Yankee Stadium 2.0 look like a quaint neighborhood ballpark. And for that, we salute you, Jerry Jones!
[7] If Joba gets a start, it won't be until Game 4 of the ALCS, so unless the Yanks are down 3-0 at that point, I'm not especially concerned.
I'd also say that, as inconsisten as his performance has been lately (typical of young pitchers!), I think what's fueling a lot of the concern over Joba is his foolish commentary on how he's doing just fine, thanks. I am strangely not bothered by that.
[8] Hey, that's AMERICA'S Stadium yer trashin, pinko! (heh. Goooo Giants!)
[9[ thank you for not being frightened by Joba's inconsistency, nor bothered by his postgame comments. That makes two of us.
I would hope that they would apply the lessons they should have learned from Joba to the way they handle Hughes next season, but I'm still not convinced that there isn't a physical issue with Joba.
[6] Bingo. Exactly. Yes, yes, yes.
That Gaudin is even in the discussion as a post-season starter stems directly from the decision to keep Hughes as the 8th inning guy.
Whether one agrees that Hughes "stabilizes the pen," "locks down the eighth," "guarantees more wins in the pen than as a fourth or fifth starter," or whatever...the fact remains that Hughes-as-eighth-inning-guy is the reason why the team is auditioning Gaudin for a possible (likely)postseason start.
[9] [10] Three.
I'd go even a little further. I think it might be the smart move to go with the shorter series and have Joba start the fourth game. I know it's nerve-wracking, but I think he's quite a bit better than whomever the Tigers throw out there in the fourth rotation slot. Whereas I'm not convinced Sabathia/Verlander favors us, at all.
Are the Yanks interested in adding Aroldis Chapman?
They better be.
[13] I would usually argue for a short pitching staff and a long bench for the playoffs, but I wonder if the team shouldn't go with a "starter-by-committee" in the fourth slot. Tell Joba to start and throw balls-to-the-walls for three or four innings, pitch count be damned, and then mix and match from there.
They're obviously interested. The question is how high they would go in a bidding war. It's also probably another reason why they won't sign a big money FA OFer, and will devote their available funds to Chapman instead.
Right now, I'm not sure that I would put Joba on the PS roster.
Joba should swallow his chewing tobacco and go on the DL so I don't have to see him or hear him.
[17] Unfortunately, the options to replace him are less promising, unless the team opts to go with only 9 or 10 pitchers. Unless you prefer to see Mitre or Melancon or Bruney or Albie or Edwar or Towers instead of Joba.
They’re obviously interested. The question is how high they would go in a bidding war
It will probably be the same as when Contreras was available, in that it'll come down to the Yanks and Red Sox and maybe the Angels.
[15] That's an option.
Another is: extra start on short rest for CC.
[20] If they have a conviction about Chapman, they can't allow the Sox to get him.
[19] As I said somewhere today, Melancon has been abandoned.
To me, the threshold question is does Joba have any physical issues. If he does, I would shut him down now.
At this point, I would try to ramp Aceves up enough to be the 4th starter. Girardi is completely wasting him as a caddy anyway, so it's not like you lose anything from the bullpen. Of course, Girardi could do something novel like actually try to win these remaining games to ensure only three starters are needed in the first round, but I guess that's taking the easy way out.
I suppose Girardi can throw CC & AJ on 2-3 days rest to finish up the season...
[18] Ha!
I've actually gotten over this feeling though I know from whence it comes. Just look at it this way with Chamberlain: It's over. There's no point in lamenting what could have been. Anything they can salvage from Joba now t is gravy. He's a sunk cost, whether it was due to mismanagement, injury or psychosis.
I agree with william about Aceves [23]. It probably won't happen but I feel like he's their most capable option at this point.
Too bad about Wang. It never should have come to this.
[25] Yes, but, its not like Wang has done great as a postseason starter.
As for Chapman, I say, heck yes get him signed - but make he's signed to a minor league deal, NOT a major league deal. No reason to start using a 40-man spot (and options) on a guy who's not nearly ready for the majors, from what I understand. He is indeed exactly the kind of talent the Yanks should pay top dollar for.
Aceves has started five MLB games in his career. He's not an option. Plus, there's no time and I don't see how that experiment makes them more likely to win those games (for those that think every game right now is a must win).
Hughes was obviously the guy. Both Mitre and Wang have started more games than him this season. That's awful. Just a pitiful use of resources.
But at least the 8th inning is covered...so Chad Gaudin can start a playoff game (if they get that far - hello AJ "I've never pitched in the post-season" Burnett!).
[27] But he has been a starter for much of his professional career. Aceves IS a starter that the Yankees are using in the bullpen. The reason the "experiment" doesn't hurt the teams chances in the remaining games is because he would replace Joba, who has been awful, and Girardi doesn't use him anyway, so nothing is lost out of the bullpen.
[26] Using Wang on short rest in 2007 was awful. True, Hughes saved Clemens in Game 3 and Mussina wasn't a great option. But they should have been relying on Hughes in a rotation spot. Now, like then, they end up with vastly inferior options. Awful. I'll even go back to 2006 and say Hughes, from AA, should have been starting over Wright.
So three years of babying Hughes means....Chad Gaudin.
Fantastic!
[28] He has next to no experience starting games at the highest professional level. Hughes has more. Joba has more. Gaudin has more. Mitre has more. Hell, Ian Kennedy has more. The last two weeks of the season are exactly the wrong time to be experimenting. Not that they didn't have the last three months or anything.
And on Joba, the Joba Rules existed before Girardi was the manager. What next, you're going to blame Girardi because they didn't bunt on Schilling?
[30] At a certain point, experience is trumped by poor performance. Listing Hughes who is not stretched out and Kennedy who is coming off major surgery, makes no sense. The other guys all stink. I'll take Aceves.
[31] I'm sure that there are some on this site who would love to try to make that case
[30] You don't have to convince me about Hughes, but we know that's not an option, so it's not worth discussing. Joba has been awful, so his experience isn't exactly a selling point. Aceves may not have started in the majors, but he isn't a rookie out of college. He has a relatively long pro career and seems more than capable of handling the task. I am not interested in who has the most experience, but who is capable of pitching the best. After the top-3 and Hughes, that man is Aceves.
[32] Hate to break it to you but Aceves isn't stretched out either.
The best plan was to flip Joba and Hughes back in July. The Yanks have weirdly try to play it conservative and aggressive. The end result looks like they have no clue.
[31] Who is blaming Girardi for the Joba rules? Why even bother when the things to criticize are much more obvious, like punting the game with Bruney and Albaledejo and not even anticipating that Morales (.937 OPS vs. RHP; .789 OPS vs. LHP) would PH by having Marte ready.
[35] Aceves has been throwing 2-4 innings as Joba's caddy. If he starts three times, he can probably stretch himself out to 5-6 innings, which is exactly what you'd get from all of the other options.
I am not arguing what WAS the best plan, but stating what I now think IS the best plan. Before the season started, I suggested turning Hughes and Joba into hybrids who would swap roles during the season, but that ship has sailed.
So three years of babying Hughes...
To be fair, Hughes has had a bit of trouble staying healthy.
[35] You're still talking about the past. I agree they should have flipped those two, as does william, I believe.
As for Aceves not being stretched out, they've shown that they are willing an able to do it with him. There's no way they're touching priceless Ming vase #2, Phil Hughes. I might trust Aceves more than Hughes anyway, for the reasons william listed. Hughes is still a baby, and I think Aceves could probably handle it better.
[37] When's the last time Aceves pitched?
That ship sailed in August.
They've consistently chosen to protect the pen at the expense of the rotation. The result of that? Chad Gaudin.
Awful.
[37] That could well be the best plan.
In fact, that slot comes right before Sabathia in the rotation. Aceves, Somebody (depending on situation), Hughes for two (we're talking about what should happen, and imagining that somebody could get Girardi over his mantras, right?), that could make seven or eight innings and the fact that you wouldn't have Hughes the next day (or maybe even for two days) wouldn't be such a big deal. Of course, if the game was out of hand one way or the other, Hughes could stay in
jailthe bullpen and watch.Aceves has pitched 7 innings this month. He's not close to ready.
As to why, I wonder if he's still not 100%.
[42] If that's true, I guess he's not getting stretched out. But if he's physically okay, they should do it. There's time before the ALCS, should the Yanks get there, Greinke willing.
If he's physically okay the larger question would be why the **** is he pitching so little and twisted firestarters like Bruney and Mitre pitching so much.
[43] My bet is that they expect him to be okay, but are being very careful with him to be sure.
New thread, by the way.
We're back to where we started. If there's time for Aceves, there's time for Hughes (8.2 IP this month).
Too bad there's not time for either.
[40] No your back to arguing what they will do. In that case, you are right, there is no chance Aceves will start.
To sum things up, I think Hughes should have been groomed to re-enter the rotation, but not that is not going to happen, I think Aceves shoudl fill the void. Of course, while still possible, that also isn't going to happen, so buckle your seat belts for Joba and his awesome mechanics. At this point, I'd almost rather see Gaudin with a short leash leading into Aceves.
[45] I don't know if it's that if there's time for Aceves then there's time for Hughes, since Aceves had been routinely pitching more than an inning and Hughes rarely at best. But I think it's fair to say there's no chance they're moving Hughes out of the eighth either way. Just let it go.