Just win.

Werd...

Won't it be a bitch if this gets rained out?

I almost don't see the upside to watching this game. The Yanks are supposed to win, and it will be their first in eight chances. Not that thrilling. Meanwhile, if they lose, it will be soul-sucking. Is it worth the risk? Could I abstain even if I thought it was the wise choice to do so? Probably not.

[3] They can start winning the rest of their games against Boston if they win the one tonight, Hawk!

How about starting a streak of their own with a CG shutout or CG QS from CC? I'll sure sign up for that at this pernt!

: )

[4] True, true. The streak must start somewhere.

And ... begin!

So, what brand of loss will tonight's be? I predict a real gut-wrencher: maybe CC takes a no-hitter into the tenth but the then loses 1-0 on a Big Papi HR?

According to Pete Abe:

Brian Bruney threw 25 pitches of live BP to Angel Berroa...and Ramiro Pena. He felt fine and will start a rehab assignment on Saturday at Trenton.

There is something really, perversely funny about this, but I just can't quite put my finger on it.

[6] You son of a bitch.

[8] ; )

Hmmm..all's quiet here before the storm.

Bring it.

[10] I already sat through my storm today thanks, wrath of God type stuff, too. I posted about it on the food thread earlier. Check it out MP...

: )

c'mon CC!

Wang to start Wednesday! Surprising.

[14] do we have an off day? MOnday?

[15] No, his wife is scheduled to give birth...

nice Jetes!

[16] so they are giving him extra days? makes sense.

[14] I didn't agree with starting him yesterday, and I don't agree with starting next week. But it looks like the organization is staying the course. We'll see.

Actually, I'm going to the game this Tuesday. Not seeing Wang get bombed = good. Seeing AJ get bombed = not good.

the ball is bigger than pedroia.

[12] I went back and read your post. Good stuff...almost as good as fishing!

[19] Tuesday, is that the Nats?

Any way that was intentional???

I don't think they really meant to give Wang an extra day. His wife is scheduled to be induced on Tuesday (if the baby doesn't arrive on its own by then). So they pushed him up one day.

It's the Nationals. The 15-42 Nationals. Who are on the verge of becoming the 15-43 Nationals. If he can't get them out, put a fork him in.

Oh good, benches are warned. This means by rule, if I recall correctly, that a Yankee pitcher must be suspended.

[24] I love that new expressoin: "put a fork him in."

So, was it intentional??

[24] So they pushed him up one day.

Who, Wang or the baby? Yuk-yuk-yuk.

[23] no doubt intentional. now we can't retaliate. i hate that bs.

[25] Who knows, I'm listening to the game tonight. I will say that the other night Eck went on for about two innings how Becket threw intentionally at Jeter. Then the camera cut to Joba and both Sox announcers comment with conviction about how Joba throws at the Sox players and how they wanted some retribution.

[28] I'm not worried about retaliation. I'm worried about CC getting tossed just for throwing inside.

[30] i'm worried about both. i like watching puke get plunked.

Rob is swinging at eye-level pitches.

[28] I don't mind the lack of "retaliation"...I just hate how suspensions are handed out bizarrely. If the umps are so sure that it was intentional--and they did warn the benches early--and he did actually hit A-Rod, then there should be a suspension. Beckett, no suspension. AJ, suspension.

Whether it was intentional or not the best revenge is a hit by Cano.

[34] Word.

could Robbie just have a season where he didn't flip between ROTTEN and RIPPER like some schizophrenic???

meanwhile, kay gibbers on about protection ... look, alex isn't hitting because he's missing pitches he ought to be hammering, not because he's not getting pitches to hit.

Robbie hasn't had an actual strike yet! All fouls!

Damn. That's not the way it's supposed to work in an eleven pitch at-bat.

[34] for sure. i know i'm just being petty but i still like watching puke get plunked. Though I guess Bay is the plunkee these days.

[36] He is walking a lot, though.

at least the virtual 9 is better than the real 9 has been.

[38] You know if Puke was a Yankee he'd be one of the most popular players. As it is I hope he never gets another hit.

[40] umm, I should note that was a feature on the MLB Network just now. I've never watched a game on the MLB Network. DO they always do that?

[21] Yeah they were a nice bunch of guys. Odd as Hell running into six Yankees fans at my golf course due to a rain storm while visiting N'ville for Bonnaroo.

: )

[39] "A lot" in this cases being relative, of course.

[41] i can't stand the guy. I don't hate red sox reflexively, just can't stand him. and Beckett.

I feel sick. they let a man on 2nd with no outs stranded again. they should jump all over penny!!

My kingdom for a w tonight, just can't stand not winning a single game v the blowsox

damn red sox

Why so careful to Youkilis??

What the hell. Must every game start this way?

[49] groundhog day

[48]

.350/.472/.637

There must be a script for these games...not even one inning in and the Yankees have already squandered a scoring chance and had a starter unwilling to throw strikes.

Cano is clearly in his swing at anything mode...I can understand why Girardi keeps batting him 5th. When the same guys keep making the big outs, it isn't a coincidence.

[51] Well, yeah, but the .472 isn't a reason to be careful with him -- it's the resuilt of being careful!

Okay, half way home, CC...

Nothing like a crisp, energy-filled Yankee-Sox game. We should be all done before midnight.

[53] Sure. But don't forget .350 and .637.

The Yankees really need to jump on Penny.

With Livan Hernandez pitching so well for the Mets, I can't understand why they wouldn't move him to the bullpen?

[55] Yeah, I guess the .637 is pretty scary.

Spanky McSkittles!

That must have made Penny very annoyed. He made maybe five excellent pitches, Swish fouled them all off, then he made a little mistake and Nick pounded it.

There have been alot of foul balls off Penny, which is usually a bad sign for a pitcher. Hopefully that holds true.

Bring. Him. Home

[60] I'll say. Between Cano and Swisher there were enough foul balls for full game.

Why is it a bad sign?
Not disagreeing; I mean, what underlying feature of the pitching does it reveal, that then means bad news for the pitcher?

I fear a bunt.

The good new is that my prediction [6] is already moot. Meanwhile, Melky is...bunting?

bunt time!

Knew it.
If Melk were a good bunter, I'd be okay with it.

Ah, good! The bunt is off!

[62] It means you aren't missing bats...and perhaps that with a little better timing (that might come next time around), the hitters might start putting those in play.

singleton with the genius ... "he's trying to put 2 runners in scoring position for cervelli, his #9 hitter"

maybe he should be trying to get the run in *before* he has to leave it in the hands of his 9th place hitter ... who frankly, isn't a very good hitter at all.

Bunting gives away outs...attempting bunts gives away strikes. Neither is a good thing.

[62] The old adage (maybe even fact) is that a batter's BA goes up dramatically the more pitches he fouls off. I don't know if this has ever been verified. At the very least it runs up the pitch count.

That was a strike, Melk.

At some point, the Yankees have to get hits against Boston when they put men on base.

you had to swing at that melky - you love swinging anyway

Meanwhile, the Yankees have to be concerned about Penny's rising pitch count.

[70] Certainly seems to be true. Intuitively, the batter is disposing of the pitches the hurler wanted to throw, and eventually gets a hitter's pitch...

[74] Ha!

Melky's nuts, that was right down the poop chute. I did like the AB otherwise, for our sometimes undisciplined Melky.

Swisher did it AGAIN!!!!

god damn nick you are a dipshit on the bases

swisher is just awful at times.

And now baserunning...

Oh, freaking Swisher.

How the hell is this team so damn bad at base running???

Why do the Yankees lose these games against Boston?

Poor Cervelli gets a DP for that.

[58] You dipshit!

[83] Lately it's been the starting pitching ... and Nick Swisher.

[83] we just saw how - can't give you the why they do this

Jeez, if Frankie's hit had traveled two feet further, or higher, it would have hit the Monster, two runs... Instead another boneheaded base running gaff.

Swisher has done this at least 4 or 5 times now. Does Girardi address it?

Jesus H Christ

[86] It's not the starting pitching...in spite of having such poor starts, the Yankees would have a great chance to win these games if they would simply not play like shit.

And it gets better...

I hate this fucking team!

god damn this didn't take long to get tortuous

Then again, let us review [6].

Do the Yankees ever lead these games?

No comment

I am sorry, but you can't tell me that games don't turn on stupid plays like that. Flaherty just used the word momentum, and I have to agree. The Yankees are playing Boston like they don't feel they belong on the same field and it shows.

papi is a lame asshole as are the red sox fans calling for him

[91] I just meant the last two games.

I don't have a problem with that HR so much as the fact that it's the first run scored. Yanks had a man on second with no outs two innings in a row.

[91] Or, they would have a great chance to overcome bad base running if the starters weren't for shit. Really, the starting pitching has been not so good.

[98] i think they were chanting "Steroids steroids..." I'm sure of it.

this is unbearable. they manage to get swept and getting big stupid pop-up out of his slump

[98] Sadly, this is one complaint that Yankees fans have corporately conceded the right to make, with the endless curtain calls the last few years.

[100] It's alot easier to simply run the bases like you aren't drunk then to pitch effectively to good lineup in a hitter's park.

we suck

Why is Swisher such a bonehead on the basepaths? Anyone can make a mistake once, but twice? It's not like he's Reegie Corona, who gets on base so rarely he doesn't know what to do when he gets there. If Bay didn't get that ball, Swisher would have had plenty of time to score. There was no reason to take the risk he took.

When I said they've lost in this series due to bad starting pitching and Nick Swisher, I think it's true. Add a dominant Beckett if you must. Yesterday it was Wang and Swisher what sunk the ship.

Hey Ortiz doubled his HR total in this series. Pending more home runs of course.

[97] I think games turn on one team scoring more than the other. Swisher's bad base running does not make AJ and Wang stink it up...I just don't accept that.

[106] It isn't just twice...he was also picked off third base earlier in the year, has been thrown out trying to stretch a single into a double when the team was down and I am pretty sure he was doubled off earlier in the season.

this is shaping up to be an EXTREMELY frustrating game.

i've had to reboot my DSL TWICE already.

WTF happened after Hacky McHeadfirstslide K'd last inning?

nothing good, obviously.

[103] yes, but since i don't do i can sit on my high horse and cast judgment. and nothing excuses papi from doing it. if he was really the player he thought he was this coming out for a curtain call for some random hr should embarass him.

[104] ...like you aren’t drunk...

Hmmm...maybe you're on to something here.

[95] Actually, I don't think we've had the lead against Boston since that first AJ disaster.

[108] I know you don't...and I am not trying to make you. I just really believe that how you feel can impact how you do...and I have to believe the Yankees came away from the top of the 2nd not feeling very good about themselves. In fact, I don't think they feel very good about themselves just because they are playing Boston.

[110] Cervelli flied out to Bay, at the wall... and Swisher was rounding third as Bay's glove closed on the ball. DP.

And then, the unspeakable happened, I'll let someone else explain it.

[112] I am getting there.

I don't think he'd have been picked off 3B. He was out because the 3B coach pushed him.

Hmmm. You gotta wonder about our coaches...

[117] Right, but the coach pushed him because he wasn't paying attention.

swisher does a few too many stupid things in general. i don't think he is stupid - but he does stupid basbeall things. air mailing your throws as much as he does is mental to me. damon can't help his shitty throws, but swisher can.

I hate to say it, but I think the answer is this simple: Swisher is kind of dumb.

christ.

swisher DOUBLED UP AGAIN!?!?!?!

2 homeruns to ortiz?!?!?

this is going to make me go all Herbert Lom over here.

[120] I agree.

[119] Oh, well, I guess we're at odds about that. i think he's kind of dumb. (Though I also think Damon is kind of dumb, and he doesn't do bonehead things on the field.)

guys, it is 1-0 in the third inning. chill.

[118] And why was he not paying attention? Because he and the coach were chit-chatting. Shouldn't the coach have said something before the pickoff attempt came flying their way?

[120] kinda dumb + 6 red bulls a game = not a whole lot of thinking going on

hopefully swisher thought there were 2 outs...

My God but Jeter has good Karma.

[124] Fair enough...but at some point it stops being about the score and starts being about how poorly this team plays against a team that isn't better than they are.

[126] Hm, good point, that can't help. It's an induced ADHD situation.

I hope we have lots of base runners when Tex homers tonight.

[114] In fact, I don’t think they feel very good about themselves just because they are playing Boston.

Aha..then which is the cause, which is the effect? I put it to you that Swisher's blunder is the product of playing Boston. Therefore, the game has not nor will not turn on any given play. Rather, all seemingly pivotal plays are themselves a consequence!

Moot point? Discuss.

[125] I've played my fair share and I know that when the third basecoach says something to you, you don't turn around to look at him.

[123] he may well be dumb - i am not sure yet. in his interviews he comes off more goofy than dumb - but i could easily decide he is dumb.
damon sounds like someone who has smoked too much weed.

[131] I think the Yankees take the field waiting for the shoe to drop, so it eventually does. And, once someone makes a blunder, the collective guard gets let down.

[129] i think before the next red sox series, cashman and the steinbrothers should bring R. Lee Ermey in for a little pep talk.

i imagine something like this taking place:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-TAGNCEHM6g&feature=related

For two straight games now the Yankees are letting a pitcher with mediocre stuff hold them down.

[134] Yeah, I dunno. That doesn't sound like Jeter to me. Or Damon. Or Posada (who I understand is not playing), Sabathia, Teixeira...

But I'm just guessing. I don't know what they're thinking.

The Yanks this season, quite simply, are chokers when playing Boston. Starting with Rivera choking away the save, and frequently demonstrated by the offense's inability to get base runners home. To me, that is the psychological component in a nutshell.

[133] I actually think he might just be drunk.

Pretty bogus call on strike three to A Rod but whatever.

[138] i think that is a stretch. it may be true but it is also true that the Yankees were seriously playing bad when they played Boston a few weeks back. And to be fair, they started to struggle a bit with the bats before this series. Cano, Arod, Damon were all cooling off for example.

Evening, Team.

I'm pleasantly surprised to come home and find that, one hour into the game, it's actually still a game.

I feared the worst.

Crud. 2004 was the end for this team. Thirty years from now, we'll be talking about the Curse of Dave Roberts while Boston's piled up another seven rings.

[133] One can smoke too much weed?

[142] Be glad you didn't watch. Esp. Swisher's base running.

I'll watch 1 more inning of this nightmare, if the yanks don't score or if they score, I'll turn it off. TV, Blackberry, Bronx Banter, everything. I don't think I have the stomach to go through this again

[141] They were actually 9-6 heading into the first sweep, and that sent them into a tailspin.

I'd like to think [138] is way off base, but at some point there has to be accountability instead of excuses. What you are seeing in these games against Boston are all the reasons that usually lead to early exits in the post season. I think this team has the sheer talent to overcome alot, but am seriously concerned about its makeup and managerial leadership in a big game (especially against Boston).

[146] Okay, that's fair. That's all we can ask of you.

[143] Not exactly...the Yankees marched into Fenway at the end of 2005 and took the division and then decimated the Sox in a 6 game sweep in 2006. This is a one season phenomenon.

[146] as Troy McClure said, "sweet liquor eases the pain ..."

[148] thanks, just filling you guys in. I know you were all wondering what my plans were

[147] that is true. the 9-6 part.

[147] I’d like to think [138] is way off base, but at some point there has to be accountability instead of excuses.

Unless your name is Wang and you don't escape the third inning!

I'm just yanking your chain, man, but this struck me as funny given how forgiving you have been with Wang's last two starts and even AJ's last outing.

Anyway, I'm trying to put my blind-optimist-lenses back on. It's still only 1-0.

[152] I honestly think the Sox getting Mo and then immediately coming back down 6-0 against AJ set the tone for the rest of these games.

And I hate the way the troll's top hand barely holds the handle.

[151] ;-P

[153] Don't yank to hard...besides, Wang is a two-time 19 game winner who is one start from being banished, despite being handled poorly by management. I think he is being forced to accept an inordinate amount of accountability.

[155] Troll.
CC the troll-killer.

sit down ugly -

[155] weeping absolutely everything about that man and his stance are hate inducing

does anyone else wish that a-rod had turned around and laid his elbow upside varitek's head after getting hit in the 1st???

[153] Blind optimist lenses.
That's an unsettling metaphor.
If he's blind... why does he need lenses?

[160] I was hoping Cano would answer with his bat, but then he just started swinging at every pitch.

[160] Or five years ago.

He's still got some quick hands, that Cano.

But man, this is no good. He'll be at .270 before long.

time for robi to put in some extra time with long

[165] assuming he is not already

[166] Why, is Long a head transplantist?

[165] Cano has been out of whack for a while now that if Long hasn't been working with him there's really no reason to have a hitting coach.

Again, I can understand why Girardi keeps putting Cano in the 5th slot when he is so obviously struggling. Cano's ABs were killer yesterday and they've already done damage today.

Is it just my impression or does abraham seem to enjoy it when the yanks struggle. he keeps coming up with lame attempts of comedy regarding their stats. I just don't enjoy it at all.

The Red Sox are pretty much a .500 team against everyone, but the Yankees.

umm, nice throw?

Flaherty mentioned it, but that Swisher f - up was a textbook momentum killer. If there is such thing.

[169] Don't read him then...I seldom do.

I don't think Wang's struggles are mental, Kay.

Man, I really half expected Matsui might be out on that. I guess he's not *that* slow.

[169] I think it's a zen thing with him.

PINCH HIT POSADA.

Two nice hits in a row. Good hitting on both counts.

Cano hs just got rocks in his head. He makes Melky look like a baseball scientist.

"Yesterday it was Wang and Swisher what sunk the ship."
So, we lose by 1 run, and Jeter, ARod and Cano go 0-12 and leave a ton of LOB... and it's Swisher who lost the game?

[176] You know what...that's not a bad idea. Casey Stengel or Billy Martin would do just that here.

lowell's hip>matsui's knees

[157] Wang, who won 19 games two seasons ago, who has pitched historically poorly, should not have made the last start, is apparently getting another start, and who has displaced someone else from the rotation. I'm not sensing undo accountability there.

I do agree that he has been handled poorly. It really goes back to the overreaction of calling up Wang when Joba get hit by that line drive.

[173] I "try" to avoid it but sometimes he may have interesting information. when he sticks to that its fine... he seldom does though.

The Yankees are now one inning away from having the Sox bullpen become a factor. Getting shut down by Penny is an embarrassment.

[179] No, it was mostly Wang. And I'm now done with that dead horse.

Big Papi homered again?? How is it possible that this guy is finished against every other team but he takes out ace deep??

9:30am and I need a drink already..this Yankee season is going to raise my blood pressure...

Melky and Cano are Dumb and Dumber, and Swisher is their agent.

[179] That's correct. The damage was done well before those three had a chance to ply their impotent trade.

I warned you guys. see you tomorrow. just cannot stand Penny winning this game v CC

[183] Pete Abe is fine for information--clubhouse stuff. Any intereptation or analysis is useless. It takes a careful filter to skim for facts and tune everything else out.

nice play cano -

That makes me even more pissed about his slump.

This guy has ungodly talent.

There's no reason for him to be the player he is.

[187] Dumb that, OYF.

Yours,
Robbie

[185] One more kick for me...the problem with that is Wang pitched as poorly last time out, but the Yankees still battled back. With Wakefield throwing slop last night, they should have got to him for more than 3 runs. We kind of expected Wang to be off, and he was. What wasn't expected was the Yankees bats and Swisher would play like little leaguers.

The Yanks are tight. Tight! Just like the last game three at Fenway. Girardi needs to learn massage or something.

[189] Okay, but you're gonna miss the good part.

christ.

having cano on your team is like having the hots for the femme fatale in a noir film ...

[187] so you think cano is dumber than melky who you dubbed one of the dumbest players ever last year :}

[135] [138] Please choose one of the following:

Hank and Hal should pay off these humps and let the kids play. At least we'd get some effort, determination, and hustle, instead of this "horseshit!"

I loathe and detest guaranteed money!

This "product" sucks ass! I'm not impressed! Shitty play, shitty umpiring, players with the intellect contained in a thimble making millions for perpetrating a fraud, ridiculous...

I'd rather watch Nekkid Twister on pay per view @ $40 a pop!

FOX news is even better than this! At least they're "On It!"

God forbid pussy Matsui places Lowell in the expensive seats on that "play!"

These fuckers don't have a clue with respect to playing MLB!

This team couldn't be any softer if they dressed like the Stay Puft Marshmallow Man and bled from their pussies once a month!

Wow! I've never seen anything like this on MLB playing fields!

[192] You just have to let it go. This is the year I'm letting Robbie go. It just aint gonna happen.

[197] Heh heh heh heh he!

Very nice.

[194] So, reducing your argument, you are basically saying that if you KNOW a player will stink it up, it somehow counts against him less that he is stinking it up?

Yes, we all knew that Wang would be off. That's why he SHOULD NOT have started. That We knew the wreck was coming does not mean that Wang was not driving the train.

Ortiz is a bit of a microcosm for Yankee opponents. It seems like everyone steps up their game vs the Yanks. And rightly so, they are the Yankees after all.

How can you have 5 hits and no runs?

OH.

MY.

FUCKING.

GOD.

HE DROPPED THE BASEBALL.

god damn what the hell?

Well, well, well.

What will happen next??

He dropped the baseball.

Like a circus clown.

Speechless...this team is simply overwhelmed by the Red Sox.

his timing was probably off since he took longer to put his glove up and run after it like a little leaguer

The only good thing about that is Big Papi was lolllygagging, assuming it would be caught.

[209] Damon dropped the ball because he was overwhelmed? By Papi's magnificence?

[211] That's true, that part was pleasing.

Also, I do like how CC is completely unfazed by it. Imagine Mussina after a play like that??

[207] probably something involving pesky's pole

[212] Perhaps tense or anxious is a better word than overwhelmed.

[213] ha ha hah ah ah ah ah ah !!!!

Indeed!

Good old sour puss!

[200] Yep. After five seasons you have to think that you've got the player you got. More and more 2006 is looking like the fluke, not what we should expect.

[192] Much of the problem problem, and you won't like this, is because he doesn't walk. You want Cano to be Ichiro. But Ichiro--for all of his strengths and faults--is a rare breed. Most hackers simply cannot maintain their average for extended periods.

[202] Wang is starting because if he can turn it around he'll be a huge asset. Besides, I don't think his performance was horrendous, especially when you factor in the misplay. This Yankee team has a lineup that should be able to overcome 4 runs, especially against the pitcher they faced last night.

Cmon now everyone, settle down. We are Yankee fans, we follow the greatest team in the history of American sports! We will crush the Red Sox in the fall, crush them I say!! (The genki-health tonic I just drank is doing the job, am full of confidence now :)

[217] I wish Girardi would just bat Cano 7th and leave him there. I pulled up the numbers last night...when Cano moves up the order, he stops hitting. The Yankees have the depth to move Cano down, but for some reason, Girardi keeps banging his ahead against the wall with Cano.

[198] It's a chicken-egg thing, but Cano is more talented, so his dumbness is more frustrating.

Come on, John. We need at least one base runner for Tex's homer.

[218] I don’t think his performance was horrendous

And here we find the difference in fundamental assumption from which our respective subsequent arguments follow.

this IS the most frustrating game of the year for me.

we keep playing like shit.

rolling over for the fucking red sox.

AND my fucking DSL keeps cutting out over and over and over and over again.

i'm nearly blind with rage over here and that's been a LONG time ...

[200] [217] I know, I know. You're both right. I'd already written him off last year, finally coming around to the idea that we should entertain notions of trading him. But then he came out flaming and I was suckered in (albeit cautiously) that this time would be different.

Sigh.

[219] I am a Yankee fan, OK...

These are not Yankees!

These are the Keystone Cops!

This series really makes me wish the ghost of Billy Martin would come out of retirement.

[217] Mattingly did all right. Cano has the tools to be another Mattingly, on both sides of the baseball.

He has the talent to make hacking work. He has the swing for it. His problem is his focus.

Tex is forcing it now...that ball was a little out his zone.

[221] I'm not sure he IS more talented. It's easy for us to sit here and claim that this or that player SHOULD be better. And in some cases, when a player wastes himslelf with drugs or the like (Strawberry), perhaps such a judgment is warranted. But I rather think that "dumbness" or whatever is all part of talent. Thus, the player's talent comprises the totality of his physical and mental skills.

ugh this is frustrating - the yanks should be doing more against penny

[218] last night I was thinking that Girardi might sound more positive on Wang after watching the game tape. And then today he specifically references watching the video and wanting to give him one more start. Objectively Wang looked better than the line indicated. And his stuff had bite.

Brad Penny's BABIP this year is .350.
Huh, actually, we're hitting almost that high tonight! But no runs.

[227] when he would call for arod to bunt will you still be thinking that?

[227] They couldn't play for him either, William! Pfft!

Did Damon actually play any LF for the Sox? He seems to know how to play the wall.

[220] Agree 100%. He only looks like he shoud be batting higher in the order when he isn't.
[230] I'm too dumb (albeit that is part of my intelligence) to understand what you said.

[234] Eventually, I'd be calling ghost busters, but a Billy Martin team would not play this way. These games are bothersome to me not because of their impact on the standings (they'll only be 2 out and the wild card is a fall back), but because I think it says alot about how this team responds to pressure, which I also think is dependent on managerial leadership. In other words, I really don't think Girardi is the right man to lead this team.

[230] Except that the mental thing is something players actually have control over. There are stories of players who "get religion" and start taking the game (more) seriously. Schilling, for example, or so the legend goes.

[238] If and when they make the play-offs, I predict management leadership will be completely irrelevant. Insofar as leadership matters -- and I can believe it does -- Posada, Jeter, Teixeira will provide all that's needed.

[228] His problem is his focus.

How do you know? This always bugs me--he's a streaky player who hacks. Always has been, always will. Why must his bad streaks be attributed to some moral failing.

Also, as much as I loved Mattingly, I wouldn't necessarily use him as a comparative. One could argue that Mattinly's failure to develop better on-base skills hastened his decline. Moreover, as great as he was for a few seasons, his numbers do suffer in comparison with some of the other sluggung 1B/DH's of the day.

[237] Right, so then he goes on a tear and hits .330 and it begins to look crazy that the guy's not batting third.

You guys are right, that seems to be exactly the pattern.

[228] well, except the bust-your-ass-because-baseball-is-what-you-live-for-tool

i'd package cano and wang (assuming they can get him back to being a legit SP in the next 3 months) and try and bring back a legit OF prospect in return.

dun, dunne, dunn, done.

[240] So many other players have to contribute to a championship though. Also, the way a manager can lead is by putting his players in the best position to win, and Girardi's game management is so poor, I actually think he puts them behind the 8 ball.

[232] Yes. People are too focused with the outcome, as opposed to the fact that Wang had 2 issues, velocity and movement. His velo was excellent, and his movement was inconsistant, but very good at times. It was not a 'good outing', but it was movement in the right direction.

nice decision by CC to let that one go ...

[238] At the very least, watching Martin loss his shit would be pretty funny, at least for a game or two.

[241] Mattingly's decline was related to his back and his numbers absolutely compare to his peers (five seasons of top-10 OPS+).

[245] i would agree with that account

[248] Also, Mattingly was more patient than Cano and improved as his career advanced.

[244] So many other players have to contribute to leadership? No, that couldn't be right. You don't want a dozen leaders on the team!

I don't think Girardi's game management is that poor. It's not good, but it's not really that bad.

Oh, Dusty! What a shame. Yell at that ump, loudly.

[241] I thought Mattingly's throwing his back out was the reason for his decline.

And I didn't say lack of focus was a moral failing. Just that it's lack of focus. How do I know? I guess I don't *know* but I think it's a pretty plausible extrapolation based on my observation of his ways and habits at the bat.

One could argue that Mattinly’s failure to develop better on-base skills hastened his decline.

eh, Mattingly's back is what did him wrong ... OBP or not, he'd be in the HoF if that had held up.

[239] players can definitely mature or whatever you want to call it - but some people are just dipshits or mentally frail to the point that they can't improve.
i agree with mp that the mental/approach part of the evaluation cannot be totally removed from the talent evaluation - you can have all the physical gifts in the world but if you squander it because of the ten cent head or you do not have a disciplined workout regime it doesn't amount too as much as it could have

[245] it was movement in the right direction.

I just don't see it. Go back and look at the gamelog from his starts this year--every one is the same. Walks. Hits. HRs. Flyballs. And the occasional clean inning with ground outs. I don't see anything moving in the right direction--his performance has been completely static.

In general, I agree that we should focus more or process than solely outcome. But really, am I the only one here who simply did not see all of this alleged progress?

[251] To winning, not to leadership. I definintely think Girardi's game management is very poor, but I think I've made that clear over the past 1+ years.

[252] Maybe the trainer should prescribe Ritalin for Rob.
Or would that be a PED?

[256] Well, here's one example:: Girardi calls for stupid bunts much less often than most managers. (Francona is even better on this score.)

Not only are the Yankees being undressed by a shitty pitcher, but they are also pumping up his trade value. I can just see Penny traded tonight for Matt Weiters.

[258] There have probably been about 10 examples already...and what's worse, when he should bunt, he doesn't.

Everyone is leaving the strike zone now.

[260] Ten could be right -- my point is that, e.g., Gardenhire has called for twice as many stupid bunts already.

[259] Or Pujols!

y'know ... it would be nice if alex would pull his bat out of his ass ... or whereever it's been for the last 2 fucking weeks.

[253] Of course it did. But I wrote, you will note, "hasten" his decline. Compare him to, say, FRank Thomas who had more raw power and much better plate discipline. When he was injured, he could still get on base.

When Mattingly's back went, it robbed him of power, and he had no OBP to fall back on. He was never able to extend his career as a sort of John Olerud type.

[262] He has hitters like Punto all over his lineup.

william just curiuous - not trying to start a "fight" - you were very opposed to torre and now girardi too - you watch a lot of baseball - what current mangers do you think highly of?

That was a bad AB by Arod...he had so many pitches to hit.

[266] That's not a good reason to give away outs! The idea is to have as many base runners as possible for Mauer and Morneau, right?

Gardenhire is a dreadful game manager. Terrible.

[267] I really like LaRussa and was a big fan of Showalter.

[269] Right, but it takes a lot of hits to get to those two and when you lineup is full of outs, well, sometimes you have no choice.

[267] Also, I really liked Torre when paired with Zimmer.

I thought Showalter was a great tactical manger, yet he wound up his players so tight, they couldn't win in the playoffs.

Torre handling the pressure, Zim handling the tactics. Priceless.

[271] Don't get it. I mean, I think that's wrong.
If there's a man on first and Ichiro is on deck and a weak hitter up, okay, maybe that line-up situation calls for a sac. But if a weak hitter is up and a weak hitter is on deck and a weak hitter is in the hole and then Morneau, then that's a very bad reason to bunt.

[270] [272] thanks for the answer

Just curious--how come no one ever tries the ole fake throw back to the pitcher, catch runner sleeping gambit?

My goodnees did Swisher miss a hanging curve...this is disgusting.

[265]
mattingly slugged .335 in 2/3rds of a season at the age of 29.

thomas never slugged that low until he was 40.

maybe you should find another example.

if thomas had been crippled like mattingly, he'd have been fucked too.

patience has *nothing* to do with it when there's no reason *not* to challenge you with strikes.

[275] If you have a man on 2nd, no outs and three Nick Puntos coming up, I can see bunting the man to third with Punto #1 because Punto #2 is really good at hitting weak ground balls. What I wouldn't want to bank on is either of three Puntos getting a hit.

Every hitter in this inning has missed at least one FAT pitch!

[280] I guess. If it's a tie game in the eighth or ninth.
But even three Puntos have a better than 50-50 chance of getting a hit in three PA!

c'mon matsui - make penny pay

Way to hang in and go the other way, Hideki.

Keep it up.

[275] well, are you better off letting three bad hitters swing away hoping on two hits? or an extra-baser?

That was fair.

Went over the bag.

HORRIBLE CALL!

Nice job, Hideki.

Hang in there.

[285] I don't think you are ever better off letting a Punto swing away.

AGGGGGHHHHHHH!

[252] And I didn’t say lack of focus was a moral failing. Just that it’s lack of focus.

Weeellll, OK. But these sorts of comments always sound (over the interwebs, anyway) like moral judgements: oh, he has so much talent, but he just doesn't focus (i.e., he's lazy, a hot dog, doesn't try, "wastes" his talent, etc.). In my experience, "lack of focus" is used as a code for such essentially moral judgments.

jeez

[285] I think so. Because if you get a couple of them on, then you get Morneau with base runners.

Holy sh**. How many ways to come within millimeters of success, and then fail??

That was probably ball 4, but it was tailor made to bang off the wall. The Yankees are in fact choking.

[294] Looked outside to me too, just like the pitch Cano "struck out" on in the 4th yesterday. I hate bad umpiring.

/rant

Game's not over yet!

Somebody say this isn't the Red Sox in the Yankees head. Tell me they've been shut out for 6 innings by Brad fucking Penny because he's just that dominant.

is yes contractually obligated to run annoying commericals that become even more grating during frustrating games?!?!

I think it broke into the zone, just in time.

jesus ... i need more booze.

fuck.

[295] It's bad umpiring, but much worse hitting. That pitch was screaming crush me...Matsui was taking the ball the other way, so I am not sure why he didn't jump on that. Even if you walk, they are going to bring in Del Carmen, so Matsui's job was to knock that run in. In another place against another team, Matsui knocks the cover off that. Right now, the Yankees are wilting under the pressure.

Yanks should have gotten 3 or 4 runs off Penny early. This should be a an easy goddamn Yankees win.

[291] Fair enough. I certainly don't think lack of focus is a mark of virtue, so I suppose on some level there's a moral judgment behind it.

I'm not saying he should be strung up or put in the stocks or anything, just that, yes, it drives me to distraction to see him (I'll say it) waste his talent.

Perhaps this is harsh or unfair or sanctimonious of me, I don't know.

It's just that when I see a potential for greatness not fulfilled, I get frustrated. (I hold myself to high standards in my profession too, though, so it's not personal.)

Terrific game by Sabathia. Nobody's talking about it, for obvious reasons.

[303] No kidding.

[303] maybe they should let him bat

[303] It is definitely terrific. It also points out why Wang really wasn't the reason they lost yesterday. With the way the Yankees are approaching these games against Boston, they are destined to be on the losing end regardless of how they pitch/hit.

[303] CC..thy name is "Ace"

[306] Uh.
They are destined to lose no matter how well they pitch and hit???

Wow, momentum is more important than I thought. Momentum = destiny.

Cano is just dopey. His lack of focus isn't a moral problem, it's a brain power problem. Just look at him.

[279] That's cherry-picking a bit, using his single worst season. In the seasons that followed, he slugged: .394 (!), .416, ..445, .411, .413. Now, if he could have coupled those with, say, a .380 to .400 OPB, he would have been a much more useful player and may have been able to extend his career.

As William pointed out, he DID improve in that regard some, so his .397 OBP made his age 33 season not a total loss.

I'm discussing not whether Mattingly would have been a HOF player, only that his declining SLG would have been cushioned had he been a more patient hitter. And ultimately that supports my point with Cano: it's hard for Cano-type players to have long, productive careers.

[306] william you sound like a red sox fan pre 2004 :}

[308] They have to get back to the island!!!

That 1-1 was a strike.

That's a strike.

[303] CC is terrific thus far, but let's not count our chickens before they hatch.

Nice work, Derek.

[308] By destiny, I meant that if they are going to allow the pressure to impact their performance, they won't be able to win because eventually there will be a breakdown.

nice play - just did get him

alright the red sox bp has to break sometime

[312] is that the new Scorsese film???

[311] I actually commented yesterday that if this is how Red Sox fans felt all those years, I can't imagine how they dealt with it. No wonder they created a fake curse.

[311] Who can blame him? That's what this season has been like. Okay, so it's one season. Or a half-season, whatever.

As a fan, I'm, finding it hard to adjust to an underdog role with a 200 million payroll.

[302] Fair enough. I guess when I was growing, we were instilled with the notion that "wasting" anything, but especially talent, was a moral failing. I guess that says more about me than anything else.

[309] Cano is just dopey. His lack of focus isn’t a moral problem, it’s a brain power problem. Just look at him.

Hmmmm...That could be taken wrongly.

Here we go.

[321] How do you figure?

Knew it.

Melky with two hits, it's been a while.

[310] I'll agree with that thesis. It is harder to have a longer, productive career if your value rests on your ability to hit baseballs rather than hit baseballs and work walks because the latter is easier to do when the body begins to go.

So I'll buy that, but Cano's problem isn't that he's got a lame body like Damon or Giambi or Mattingly or Matsui.

At least, so far as I know, this is *not* the reason he's not hitting.

Huh, I think I would have Posada pinch hit here. But... this may work out...

I smell a bunt.

Yes!!!!!!

Yeah!!!!

sweet!!

yes!!!!
hit and run worked.

Well that's nice.

[255] "... his starts this year–every one is the same. Walks. Hits. HRs. Flyballs"
Again, this is outcome. The Swish play could easily have been caught or been in an error. In that case, at LEAST one less hit, and 1 or 2 less runs.
Question: Did he hit 95mph a few times?
Question: Was he at 92mph or better regularly.
Question: Did a number of his pitches hav excellent sink?.

"But really, am I the only one here who simply did not see all of this alleged progress?"
No.... I think there is 1 or 2 other people.

No pinch hitter??????

FRANKIE BRAINS!!!!!!!!

Bunt that, beyotch!

CERVIX !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

That was nice hitting.

[335] Sorry! Gameday a beat behind you guys!! YAYYYYYYY!!

[328] I am stunned.

I am stunned there was no bunt.

I am stunned they executed a hit and run with getting the runner picked off.

I am stunned they got a hit.

I am stunned the runner did not get gunned down at home.

My universe is rocked.

Move the goddamn runner over.

Monkeypants, Frankie is a freaking moral saint. He works hard, he loves his mom, and he can execute a hit-and--bloody-run. He's a mensch.

Looks like Girardi woke up and woke the team up. Let's have a big inning here, guys!

this ump likes those breaking pitches for strikes

Jeter. Come on buddy.

[344] Girardi, nothing. That was Brian Cashman's doing.

[345] I think he's been all over the place, completely unpredictable. The ump, I mean. That's why batters on both teams are kind of pissed off.

[347] don zimmer came through again!

[343] Hah ah aha a ha a h !!! I hear he helps old ladies across the street and eats his vegetables, too.

Also, I think one reason I think it's mental with Robbie is that he doesn't seem to make adjustments very well.

Girardi never puts plays on and never makes things happen.

Jeter seems to have fouled off more than a few hittable pitches tonight.

[347] i want some credit for saying the red sox pen has to break sometime in [317]!!

Jeter, you did a bad job. BAD

Jeter swings at Ball 4.

[334] The Swish play could easily have been caught or been in an error. In that case, at LEAST one less hit, and 1 or 2 less runs.

And Ortiz' ball that was crushed to the triangle could have been a HR. I'm not playing the predetermined outcome game.

Question: Did he hit 95mph a few times?
See Farnsworth, Kyle.